Les Jones

Greenpeace still exists? Huh. Ya learn something new every day.

Off the top of my head, the last time I can remember seeing or hearing about any Greenpeace activism was at the Oak Ridge Complex 21 hearings, which were, what, like 15 years ago?

"The environmental movement has completely squandered its credibility."

What the heck is "the environmental movement", anyway? I think you've been reading way too many right-wing blogs, Les.

Well, what the heck are "right-wing blogs", anyway?

Do you think the environmental movement (Greenpeace, the various population projects, etc.) is very credible? Do you trust them?

In the 1960s, they were predicting overpopulation. Too many people, not enough food. Millions of people were supposed to starve to death in the U.S. in the 1980s.

Instead, the finger-waggers are now telling us that the big new problem in the U.S. is obesity, which is exactly the opposite problem that was predicted.

We were supposed to run out of oil. You're the same age I am, so you probably remember the '70s TV commercial with the kid walking on the beach, talking about how there wouldn't be any oil left when he grew up. "Come on, America. Give us kids a break."

It's 30 years later, and there's tons of oil left. The gas lines in the '70s were caused by the actions of a cartel, rather than resource exhaustion. So it turns out that kid was a little liar. And with today's "obesity epidemic" he's probably a big fat liar by now.

There are plenty more examples. (We were all supposed to be swimming in disposable diapers right now, remember?) It isn't that environmentalism is wrong, it's that it's too wrong too often for too many wrong reasons. Its message has been co-opted by secular religionists, New Agers, Marxists, and every other fringe movement.

I still respect groups like The Nature Conservancy that are going out and buying land rather than sitting in ivory towers being environmental scolds.

"Well, what the heck are "right-wing blogs", anyway?"

That's exactly my point. "Environmentalism" has about as much meaning as "right-wing."

Did you ever see The Decline of Western Civilization? There's a scene where someone in one of the bands goes on this long rant about the term New Wave - "There's noise, there's ska, there's power pop, there's rockabilly, there's punk. But New Wave doesn't mean shit."

"Environmentalism" encapsulates a whole boatload of different issues, which often are completely unrelated to each other. If you're an advocate for safe municipal water supplies, how are you discredited if an advocate for stringent vehicle emission standards says something dumb? Terri's work on invasive plants falls under the umbrella of "environmentalism." It's sloppy thinking to devalue a report she writes merely because of what someone at Greenpeace says about global warming.

As far as TNC, I've got very mixed feelings about them, as pretty much everyone who's worked with them does. If you're thinking about sending them money, send it to the Foothills Land Conservancy instead.

Err...that was me. Got my alter egos mixed up.

And what's right wing? Everything to the right of Noam Chomsky? We can play word games with this, but I think we both have a pretty good idea of what the terms we're using mean.

For the record, I'd say what Terri does is actual environmental science as opposed to any -ism.

Re: TNC, the more I know about a lot of big non-profits the less I like them. PBS was one of the worst. Anne Robinson tried to warn me about PBS but I wouldn't listen until I had first-hand experience.